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Is there a section to talk about Java ME? Apps, etc. (7)
to General by teroyk - 8 hrs, 44 mins ago - more...
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2011-06-02
, 04:26
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#342
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Originally Posted by ScottishDuck
Do you actually even know that official support for the N900 has ceased from Nokia?.
Not _everything_ is OSS but it does at least have the blobs tracking the latest kernel and more importantly, the blobs are sitting in a repo easily available to us. That in itself makes community support easier if and when official support ends.
And we should also remember that the OS itself is entirely open whereas maemo is not. Far more hackable.
The closed components "apparently" have been released so stskeeps tells me to the MeeGo development team working on the N900 version of MeeGo.
MeeGo is not entirely open at all, i really think you need to go read more about this.
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2011-06-02
, 04:44
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#343
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
There is no "apparently" about it, maybe if you spared a moment of your valuable time to use Google you would have found this http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1...v7hl/packages/
Do you actually even know that official support for the N900 has ceased from Nokia?.
The closed components "apparently" have been released so stskeeps tells me to the MeeGo development team working on the N900 version of MeeGo.
MeeGo is not entirely open at all, i really think you need to go read more about this.
As for the OS being entirely open, yes it is. The OS is most certainly open, it may not be entirely FOSS (not sure). Some hardware requiring closed drivers has nothing to do with the openness of _the OS_ Perhaps it's you that should be doing the reading.
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2011-06-02
, 04:53
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#344
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Originally Posted by ScottishDuck
You did not even pick up on the sarcasm but never mind eh.
There is no "apparently" about it, maybe if you spared a moment of your valuable time to use Google you would have found this http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1...v7hl/packages/
As for the OS being entirely open, yes it is. The OS is most certainly open, it may not be entirely FOSS (not sure). Some hardware requiring closed drivers has nothing to do with the openness of _the OS_ Perhaps it's you that should be doing the reading.
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2011-06-02
, 05:14
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#345
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FWIW (yes, you're talking about MeeGo openness, so I can state this!),
MeeGo.com platform does not in any way rely on closed source binaries.
The Nokia N900 hardware adaptation currently consists of:
* Bluetooth firmware, redistributable, kernel-independent, userland-independent firmware blob (this is fairly typical even on PC)
* WLAN firmware, redistributable, kernel-independent, userland-independent firmware blob (this is fairly typical even on PC)
* BME, redistributable binary blob
* TI OMAP3 SGX drivers, userland, redistributable binary blobs, matches with a kernel side driver that's fairly OK to forward port.
* Misc calibration tools for wlan, redistributable binary blobs, only really depending on a WLAN driver kernel interface
* PulseAudio algorithms for 3GPP compliance, redistributable binary blobs (you won't get good sound without this)
* Kernel, open source, no closed source modules
* Xorg driver for SGX, open source, but links to closed source SGX drivers (PVR2D interface, etc)
* Open source ofono/telephony driver and pulseaudio modules for speech communication with modem
* Misc scripts for startup and setup of N900 bits and pieces, open soure
* Camera firmware, open source (it's really just register poking). Basic camera features work without blobs.
* Battery measurement is done through kernel and open source metering
* Upcoming: blobs for accessing AGPS and almost Maemo5-quality camera usage.
For each of the closed source bits, we're actively exploring opportunities how to 1) build these in the future in case it's needed and 2) how to avoid situations where they cease to work.
As said above, rest of platform is OSS, including applications. You won't easily find sane hardware that doesn't in some way require closed blobs on ARM side. And don't say the Freerunner.
Given that the blobs exist and they are redistributable and usable, it's a better situation than not having them at all.
MeeGo.com platform does not in any way rely on closed source binaries.
The Nokia N900 hardware adaptation currently consists of:
* Bluetooth firmware, redistributable, kernel-independent, userland-independent firmware blob (this is fairly typical even on PC)
* WLAN firmware, redistributable, kernel-independent, userland-independent firmware blob (this is fairly typical even on PC)
* BME, redistributable binary blob
* TI OMAP3 SGX drivers, userland, redistributable binary blobs, matches with a kernel side driver that's fairly OK to forward port.
* Misc calibration tools for wlan, redistributable binary blobs, only really depending on a WLAN driver kernel interface
* PulseAudio algorithms for 3GPP compliance, redistributable binary blobs (you won't get good sound without this)
* Kernel, open source, no closed source modules
* Xorg driver for SGX, open source, but links to closed source SGX drivers (PVR2D interface, etc)
* Open source ofono/telephony driver and pulseaudio modules for speech communication with modem
* Misc scripts for startup and setup of N900 bits and pieces, open soure
* Camera firmware, open source (it's really just register poking). Basic camera features work without blobs.
* Battery measurement is done through kernel and open source metering
* Upcoming: blobs for accessing AGPS and almost Maemo5-quality camera usage.
For each of the closed source bits, we're actively exploring opportunities how to 1) build these in the future in case it's needed and 2) how to avoid situations where they cease to work.
As said above, rest of platform is OSS, including applications. You won't easily find sane hardware that doesn't in some way require closed blobs on ARM side. And don't say the Freerunner.
Given that the blobs exist and they are redistributable and usable, it's a better situation than not having them at all.
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2011-06-02
, 05:36
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#346
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Well done Carsten you did it again 
and what would be nice is to get an official update on the N900 MeeGo adaption from you, maybe you should start your own thread on this ?.
and what would be nice is to get an official update on the N900 MeeGo adaption from you, maybe you should start your own thread on this ?.
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2011-06-02
, 05:41
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#347
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
Just countering your
Well done Carsten you did it again
MeeGo is not entirely open at all, i really think you need to go read more about this.
(Hey, at least i'm not in the 'reopen' thread!)
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As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
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2011-06-02
, 05:44
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#348
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Originally Posted by Stskeeps
I was actually being sarcastic Carsten because Nokia peed me off big time releasing some of the closed source to you and not to this community.
Just countering your
With fact instead of speculation
(Hey, at least i'm not in the 'reopen' thread!)
I am just wondering... is there a way for YOU to release it to the team on here?. EDIT..... IN FULL !.
Last edited by abill_uk; 2011-06-02 at 05:47.
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2011-06-02
, 05:53
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#349
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
What was sarcastic about it? Perhaps you should resit your English exam before you make statements about how "sarcastic" you are being.
I was actually being sarcastic Carsten because Nokia peed me off big time releasing some of the closed source to you and not to this community.
I am just wondering... is there a way for YOU to release it to the team on here?. EDIT..... IN FULL !.
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2011-06-02
, 06:06
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#350
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
So, for good measure, let me state how this usually works in business because you really don't seem to get it:
I was actually being sarcastic Carsten because Nokia peed me off big time releasing some of the closed source to you and not to this community.
I am just wondering... is there a way for YOU to release it to the team on here?. EDIT..... IN FULL !.
* Code has copyright which generally means you can't copy it without license. You can't technically read source code even if you have it without a proper license for it/without a NDA.
* A person can be contracted to a company and then contribute modifications/code that is then copyrighted to that company. In that case, I'm that kind of person.
* A typical contractor has a NDA (Non-disclosure agreement) and cannot talk about details of the code or publish it.
* The company can release code in various forms, sometimes open source, sometimes closed source, it depends on the licensing.
* There are often very good reasons why things are kept closed source, such as patents, IPR or business reasons.
You basically can't do this kind of work without a contract - it's difficult to do a contract with a loosely-knit community. NDA's are also difficult with community members as there's no reprocussions(sp) in case of breach. How do you sue people who has nothing to loose?
Also, the people who sign the contract within the community then would effectively be unable to discuss that work with the rest of the community, which means to a seperated community with some who's previleged and some who's not.. Even I have to publish my work through a Nokia employee.
Basically, it's a slippery slope.
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As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
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And we should also remember that the OS itself is entirely open whereas maemo is not. Far more hackable.
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