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2007-08-05
, 04:52
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Posts: 3,401 |
Thanked: 1,255 times |
Joined on Nov 2005
@ London, UK
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#42
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Originally Posted by pieter_jh
I'd have thought being able to *receive* faxes on a Communicator would be more valuable than sending. Sending of electronic documents from a Communicator via fax doesn't make any sense these days - email has that pretty much covered. However I've been in many a situation where I've had real, hard copy paper documents that I've needed to send somewhere for approval/authorisation and it's been much easier for me to fax the docs than it has been to track down a scanner attached to someone elses workstation and have them scanned and forwarded via email. While I'm sure departmental scanners are becoming more prevalent (indeed our faxes are very slowly being replaced by networked photocopier machines) they're still a common sight in many UK offices and no doubt elsewhere in the world too.
I have owned communicators since the 9000 and s60s since the 6600, and have very seldom wanted to send a fax. And never known a fellow associate even mention the fax capabilities of their communications.
For an exec on the move, the ability to *receive* faxes could still be a big advantage. No doubt a third-party app will fill this void, but why force the user to go the third party route when Nokia already had it covered in the past?
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2007-08-05
, 05:30
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#43
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Originally Posted by pieter_jh
What I find ironic is when someone makes unsafe assumptions about others in an effort to take them to task over making assumptions.
WhaWhat I find interesting about the Register article, and many of the contributors here, is
how they claim to speak for 'the business user'. Not so, people that read the Reg,
and this forum, are tech heads (possibly tech heads in business, but tech heads
nonetheless) and if any such REALLY knows what the typical business user wants, better than a formalised focus group study in any case, I'd be amazed.
It's highly possible to be both savvy geek and successful businessman. California is full of them. Heck, so is Texas.
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2007-08-05
, 06:19
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Posts: 729 |
Thanked: 19 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
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#44
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Originally Posted by Texrat
Yes, people like that usually fail to understand that most of us "tech" geeks here are the ones SUPPORTING the "businessmen" and having to listen to their mad demands for all types of functionality.
What I find ironic is when someone makes unsafe assumptions about others in an effort to take them to task over making assumptions.
It's highly possible to be both savvy geek and successful businessman. California is full of them. Heck, so is Texas.
To quote a good friend of mine who works in the DoD in the D.C. area: "Hi, I'm an information technology specialist. We run sh1t now."
(It's a line from some movie as well I think)
Maybe "businessmen" in the UK and Europe need handheld fax capability, but everywhere else I've been on the planet (Middle East, Africa, Asia, and the US) they want email and have ditched their fax machines for digital senders, namely HP's line of digital senders. I think I've setup a few hundred of those over the years.
Face it, the ONLY reason folks want fax capability like that is to scan in a document and have it on their device. That's why digital senders are going to pretty much replace fax machines in ten years time. They eventually pay for themselves over time what with getting rid of a dedicated phone line and being able to scan in and eventually mass store paper documents.
The BIGGEST complaints I've heard about portable devices have been in regards to digital signatures/signing/encryption support. Particularly the lack of "options" when it comes to hardware PKI tokens (read: smart cards) since right now the Blackberry has that one sewn up with the CAC sleds (both bluetooth and attached sleds). Nokia can hit it HUGE in the business world if they would just develop and market to the U.S. Government a bluetooth or attached smartcard reader sled for their E-series phones. Well, that and get their phones through the NSA testing process for supported encryption techniques. Because once you get the U.S. Gov, you get all those contracting companies as well....Northrupp Grumman, Boeing, DynaCorp, Halliburton, etc.
As long as a device supports PKI functionality in addition to email, contacts, and calendar then the "businessmen" I work with are pretty frickin' ecstatic.
And now I'm starting to get questions "about this VoIP thing on cell phones" since we're running VoIP at work now. (read: management looking to save a few extra bucks that better be going to my damned EOY bonus!)
I got so many requests/questions about the iPhone that I basically wrote up a little internal memo and sent it around to everyone about how they will HATE an iPhone and what it DOESN'T offer them compared to their current phones.
That pretty much killed their lust for it instantly.
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2007-08-05
, 07:18
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Posts: 355 |
Thanked: 9 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
@ Helsinki, Finland
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#45
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@Millhouse,
As I mentioned a few pages back, digital scanner are coming on like gang busters. They provide the "faxing" capability that people still claim to need. At State, you see more DS (digital scanners) than fax machines. When I mentioned 3rd party apps filling the void, I was talking from the position that you will find better and more robust offerings than what Nokia would supply. You know that Nokia will only supply the cursory app with limited functionality. As I also mentioned, with the E90, you can now do everything on the outside of the phone that you could do on the inside. I wonder if S80 users are moaning about this handy feature.
@iball maybe you have me on ignore or something, but you repeated pretty much what I said about sending docs, minus the PKI info. I have tried to import my dig cert into my N95 but it will not allow it. If Nokia could add this handy feature, we would be set. The govt, is using dig certs left and right now. Even their web sites are issuing tokens for verification. All web mail users have the little RSA (or some other brand) tokens to provide use authentication access.
The developers of the E90 made a smart move in my opinion of dumping an app that for the most part is no longer needed and replacing them with wider device functionality.
As I mentioned a few pages back, digital scanner are coming on like gang busters. They provide the "faxing" capability that people still claim to need. At State, you see more DS (digital scanners) than fax machines. When I mentioned 3rd party apps filling the void, I was talking from the position that you will find better and more robust offerings than what Nokia would supply. You know that Nokia will only supply the cursory app with limited functionality. As I also mentioned, with the E90, you can now do everything on the outside of the phone that you could do on the inside. I wonder if S80 users are moaning about this handy feature.
@iball maybe you have me on ignore or something, but you repeated pretty much what I said about sending docs, minus the PKI info. I have tried to import my dig cert into my N95 but it will not allow it. If Nokia could add this handy feature, we would be set. The govt, is using dig certs left and right now. Even their web sites are issuing tokens for verification. All web mail users have the little RSA (or some other brand) tokens to provide use authentication access.
The developers of the E90 made a smart move in my opinion of dumping an app that for the most part is no longer needed and replacing them with wider device functionality.
__________________
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
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2007-08-05
, 15:49
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Posts: 729 |
Thanked: 19 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
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#46
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Originally Posted by sapporobaby
I've imported many a gov't website digital cert as well as some public email certs ot only myself but a few others. The problem right now is that my PRIVATE signing certificate is on my smartcard with no way to copy it off and place it on the N95. Slapping a cert on the phone is easy, I just BT it over and it installs itself.
@Millhouse,
As I mentioned a few pages back, digital scanner are coming on like gang busters. They provide the "faxing" capability that people still claim to need. At State, you see more DS (digital scanners) than fax machines. When I mentioned 3rd party apps filling the void, I was talking from the position that you will find better and more robust offerings than what Nokia would supply. You know that Nokia will only supply the cursory app with limited functionality. As I also mentioned, with the E90, you can now do everything on the outside of the phone that you could do on the inside. I wonder if S80 users are moaning about this handy feature.
@iball maybe you have me on ignore or something, but you repeated pretty much what I said about sending docs, minus the PKI info. I have tried to import my dig cert into my N95 but it will not allow it. If Nokia could add this handy feature, we would be set. The govt, is using dig certs left and right now. Even their web sites are issuing tokens for verification. All web mail users have the little RSA (or some other brand) tokens to provide use authentication access.
The developers of the E90 made a smart move in my opinion of dumping an app that for the most part is no longer needed and replacing them with wider device functionality.
I found somewhere on the net a whole crapload of info on it, Google around.
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2007-08-05
, 15:56
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Posts: 631 |
Thanked: 1,123 times |
Joined on Sep 2005
@ Helsinki
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#47
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Originally Posted by SD69
I couldn't agree with you more, SD69.
As to UI, you've got it backwards, S60 was designed for one thumb operation on cell phones and S80 was designed specifically for the Communicator, which had unusually wide screen format, four soft keys, function keys and QWERTY, and is very DISsimilar to Hildon. Changing the UI was NOT an easy change, like some imply.
Nokia/ES did not ignore these considerations. They made a business decision that S80 is a niche product with little 3rd party app support, that the field of handheld computer-like devices is getting very competitive, and that the migration to S60 was necessary to keep the product successful. They are trying to expand the appeal to business users, BB users, etc., who have never seen a Nokia device as a computer-like tool. Those people ask about software compatibility all the time. Their conclusion is that global sales of the S60 Communicator will exceed the sales of any previous Communicator in any previous year, and bring in NEW customers, and they are probably right. Nokia is a company that demands performance and looks 3 years out and not at the past.
I personally think that moving from S80 to S60 was an *easy* decision, really, and certainly the right decision. The communicator line and S80 was stagnated into its own position. Differences between S80 and S60 weren't certainly trivial.
Now, looking at E60, E61, E65, E90 all running essentially the same software platform, and running S60, makes it so much easier for software developers to make the decision to support it, instead of having to choose between S60 and S80. I don't see Nokia/ES management being "out of touch" with this issue at all. Talking on a general level, making features that a device with relatively limited popularity enjoy showstoppers - i.e. if the E90 wouldn't be able to come to the market without having those features - would really be a silly idea.
S80 really enjoyed a very limited set of 3rd party software support - compared to S60 - at the end of the day. It's a long term move, but you should already easily see and understand the advantages of that move.
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2007-08-05
, 16:07
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#48
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I still think the transition could have been managed better.
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2007-08-05
, 18:05
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Posts: 355 |
Thanked: 9 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
@ Helsinki, Finland
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#49
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Originally Posted by Texrat
No matter how it was managed, people were going to complain. This is evident in the article posted. The only thing the article pointed out was the negative, and moaned on and on how users were now disadvantaged. No where did it point out that S60 is transparent throughout the entire device, or that there is a plethora of software. As someone put it, this was just a simple Nokia bash session. Sales figures will ultimately determine who was right.
I still think the transition could have been managed better.
__________________
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
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2007-08-05
, 18:13
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Posts: 355 |
Thanked: 9 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
@ Helsinki, Finland
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#50
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Originally Posted by iball
Hey iball. I tried your method. My N95 will not import the .cer file. Says file type unsupported. Hmmmm..... Any suggestions? Thanks.
I've imported many a gov't website digital cert as well as some public email certs ot only myself but a few others. The problem right now is that my PRIVATE signing certificate is on my smartcard with no way to copy it off and place it on the N95. Slapping a cert on the phone is easy, I just BT it over and it installs itself.
I found somewhere on the net a whole crapload of info on it, Google around.
__________________
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
"Einstein was right. " "Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind......
Apple for god sakes bring that freaking iPhone to Canada atleast I know it'll work with my Mac